Share:
Notifications
Clear all

3/4 Size Guitars

Page 1 / 2

darrenking
(@darrenking)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 4913
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 915
Topic starter  

Hi peeps,

Now this might sound like a completely stupid question, although not on a par with asking when metric tape worms were introduced to the UK (my wife is a parasitologist and found this hilarious!!). My question is whether a 3/4 sized guitar is as literal as it sounds ie a perfect 75% replica of the full sized version.

The reason I ask this is that I am thinking of new scale length templates that I could offer Togo with with my fret slotting jig. I have never seen a 3/4 sized fret slotting template even mentioned anywhere, much less be offered for sale. Would it be cool to have a mixed guitar type template which gave slotting options for perfect 3/4 sized copies of, for example, a classical, a Martin steel string, a Fender electric, a Gibson electric, and a short bass? Oh, that’s only five. Ok, so I might have to squeeze in one of the Maccaferri scale lengths! Big surprise, I know!! Unless anybody has a better suggestion.

What do you think? I’d love hear your thoughts.

Keep safe and, most of all, be happy!

Cheers

Darren


permainan togel, Boo, Russ and 3 people liked
Quote
Russ
 Russ
(@russ)
Luthier
Rep Points: 23832
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1985
 

@darrenking

Hi Darren, the shortest scale length guitar template that I've seen for sale was a 22.5"

I've seen mini guitars that have a scale length of just over 16" but never seen a template that short. 

You could be on to a winner there

🎸🎶🙏🙂

🗝️ "Life's what you make it"🗝️


Robin, Koendb, Boo and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
darrenking
(@darrenking)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 4913
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 915
Topic starter  

Thanks for the feedback @russ.

A bit of digging on the interweb later and it seems that the sizes aren't anything like a direct scaling with 3/4 sized guitars coming in at somewhere around 90% of full scale length and 7/8 guitars at around 94%.

They're never going to be the biggest selling template but I guess it might still be worth doing just so that people could produce as accurate a scaled down guitar as possible. I think I'll leave this on the back burner to think it through a bit more before committing.

I am also working option kits for one piece neck fret slotting and also for extra wide fretboards, for 7 string bases for example so if anyone out there can ping some real life dimensions over to me that would be great.

Darren


Robin, Koendb, Russ and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Rocknroller912
(@rocknroller912)
Luthier
Rep Points: 7739
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1068
 

@darrenking 

i think one problem with scaling down the whole guitar to a smaller size would be string thickness and tension. A standard set of strings would be too slack tuned to standard pitch with a shorter length. Thicker strings don’t necessarily produce more tension as that’s mostly determined by the type of material used. 
Probably some testing needed first on a mock up scale length to get a good combination of length and string.

Some people call me a tool, others are less complimentary. Tools being useful things.


Robin, Koendb and Boo liked
ReplyQuote
Russ
 Russ
(@russ)
Luthier
Rep Points: 23832
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1985
 
Posted by: @darrenking

am also working option kits for one piece neck fret slotting and also for extra wide fretboards, for 7 string bases for example

@darrenking

Sounds great Darren. Do you still have any of you adjustable neck pocket templates? 

🙏🎶🎸🙂

🗝️ "Life's what you make it"🗝️


Robin, Koendb and Boo liked
ReplyQuote
Rocknroller912
(@rocknroller912)
Luthier
Rep Points: 7739
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1068
 

@darrenking 

I’ve just checked my book of violin measurements which is probably a good guide to the convention used for naming all instrument sizes. It shows that 3/4 and 7/8 are not an exact scale down of 4/4 and I know that these need their own strings and not just larger ones cut down.

EE4FEA2D D775 4FAC 84E1 6C32231B8A84

Some people call me a tool, others are less complimentary. Tools being useful things.


Robin, Koendb, Russ and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
darrenking
(@darrenking)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 4913
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 915
Topic starter  
Posted by: @russ

Do you still have any of you adjustable neck pocket templates?

Hi @russ,

Yes, I believe they are still on my eBay listing. As previously, if you purchase direct from me I will credit Mark and Carol with their margin the next time they order something from me.

Cheers

Darren


Robin, Koendb, Russ and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
darrenking
(@darrenking)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 4913
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 915
Topic starter  

Hi @rocknroller912,

Interesting. Does the table extend further down the page to giving the scale lengths?

Cheers

Darren


Robin, Koendb, Russ and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Rocknroller912
(@rocknroller912)
Luthier
Rep Points: 7739
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1068
 

@darrenking 

Yes I will try and get a better photo

Some people call me a tool, others are less complimentary. Tools being useful things.


Robin, Koendb, Russ and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Rocknroller912
(@rocknroller912)
Luthier
Rep Points: 7739
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1068
 

@darrenking 

If you add neck stop and body stop together, where I’ve marked in red, then that’s the scale or string length. Hope you can read the page ok.

Violin type instruments and early guitars evolved in the same part of the world so the conventions for size naming were the same. Stradivari also made very ornate parlour guitars. If you are ever in Oxford go the the Ashmolean Museum where there is one.

045817B3 0923 45B1 A59E B5D1C0643639

Some people call me a tool, others are less complimentary. Tools being useful things.


Robin, Koendb, Russ and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Russ
 Russ
(@russ)
Luthier
Rep Points: 23832
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1985
 
Posted by: @darrenking

Hi @russ,

Yes, I believe they are still on my eBay listing. As previously, if you purchase direct from me I will credit Mark and Carol with their margin the next time they order something from me.

Cheers

Darren

Thanks Darren. I'll take a look. 

🎸🙂🎶🙏

🗝️ "Life's what you make it"🗝️


Robin, Boo and Koendb liked
ReplyQuote
Russ
 Russ
(@russ)
Luthier
Rep Points: 23832
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1985
 
Posted by: @darrenking

Hi @russ,

Yes, I believe they are still on my eBay listing. As previously, if you purchase direct from me I will credit Mark and Carol with their margin the next time they order something from me.

Cheers

Darren

@darrenking

Hello again Darren. I found you on eBay but I think you may have sold out of them. 😕 

🙏🎶🙂🎸

🗝️ "Life's what you make it"🗝️


Koendb, Robin and Boo liked
ReplyQuote
darrenking
(@darrenking)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 4913
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 915
Topic starter  

@russ I hadn’t realised! I’ve listed another 50(!) so that should keep you all going for a while! Let me know if there are any other problems.

Cheers

Darren


Koendb, Robin, Boo and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Russ
 Russ
(@russ)
Luthier
Rep Points: 23832
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1985
 
Posted by: @darrenking

@russ I hadn’t realised! I’ve listed another 50(!) so that should keep you all going for a while! Let me know if there are any other problems.

Cheers

Darren

Cheers Darren.

🙂🎸🎶🙏

🗝️ "Life's what you make it"🗝️


Koendb, Robin and Boo liked
ReplyQuote
darrenking
(@darrenking)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 4913
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 915
Topic starter  

@rocknroller912 Thanks for the additional photo. The violin scaling works out at approx 94% for the 3/4 and just under 97% for the 7/8 as opposed to about and average of 90% and 94% respectively for the guitars I've seen specified and other online info. I guess this makes sense given that the violins are a smaller instrument and have a shorter scale length in the first place.

I'll work out what the scaled lengths would be for the likely candidates at these percentages and take a view.

Cheers

Darren


Koendb, Robin, Boo and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Rocknroller912
(@rocknroller912)
Luthier
Rep Points: 7739
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 1068
 

@darrenking 

Yes that makes sense. Even on a full size violin the notes are very close together higher along the fingerboard, so if the frets are closer than the width of a persons finger then it will be hard to play. 
Did you consider reducing the number of frets and stop at the point where they are too close.

Some people call me a tool, others are less complimentary. Tools being useful things.


Koendb, Robin, Boo and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Robin
(@robin)
Luthier
Rep Points: 13035
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 869
 

@rocknroller912 

Even on a full size violin the notes are very close together higher along the fingerboard, so if the frets are closer than the width of a persons finger then it will be hard to play. 
Did you consider reducing the number of frets and stop at the point where they are too close.

That was my first thought too, reduce the number of frets on a short scale length to dispense with the useless ones that would be too close together.


Koendb, Boo and Russ liked
ReplyQuote
darrenking
(@darrenking)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 4913
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 915
Topic starter  
Posted by: @robin

reduce the number of frets on a short scale length to dispense with the useless ones that would be too close together.

Hi @robin, I know what you mean but I think that they upper frets would still be needed purely from a cosmetic point of view. I mean, you wouldn’t want the see the last couple of inches of the fretboard devoid of frets even if they were useless.

Cheers

Darren


Koendb, Boo, Russ and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Robin
(@robin)
Luthier
Rep Points: 13035
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 869
 

@darrenking 

I know what you mean but I think that they upper frets would still be needed purely from a cosmetic point of view. I mean, you wouldn’t want the see the last couple of inches of the fretboard devoid of frets even if they were useless.

You're absolutely right, it would look odd. I've got 24 frets on my current build, but I seldom venture beyond the 12th when I'm playing.


Koendb, Boo and Russ liked
ReplyQuote
Koendb
(@koendb)
Customer
Luthier
Rep Points: 9262
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 624
 
Posted by: @darrenking

you wouldn’t want the see the last couple of inches of the fretboard devoid of frets even if they were useless.

One alternative: A nice but simple inlay instead of those useless frets?


Bpower, Boo, Robin and 1 people liked
ReplyQuote
Page 1 / 2