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What clear coat finishes are people in the UK using?

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Jonathan Hodgson
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I'm looking for a gloss, fairly durable clear coat that I can apply at home with no specialist spray equipment.
It seems like pretty much everything that is showcased in YouTube Luthier videos (Crystalac, Solarez etc) is unavailable in the UK (especially at the moment).
Even when it's possible (due to hazmat regulations) having stuff shipped across the pond isn't really viable. According to Solarez's website a quart of their polyester gloss would cost me $37.95... but the shipping would be $118.15!! 
The luthier's suppliers here seem to have oil based varnishes such as Crimson guitar finishing oil, a fair selection of nitro cellulose lacquer, and so far I've found one water based finish from tonetech (but no reviews anywhere to say if it's any good).
So I was wondering what people here have used and what their experiences were?


   
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Mezy
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I use car two pack clear, needs to be sprayed on but have known people to use a roller, 

a good fine flat and polish


   
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Jonathan Hodgson
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@mezy
2K rattle cans are one option I'm considering, Brad Angove seems to manage a good finish with them (though of course, that guy has lots of experience with different spray methods).


   
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Mezy
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Never tried rattle cans, I used to be in body shops so used to the 2k clear.

If you have a small body repair place near to you they may be willing to chuck in the spray booth with another job and lick it over for you


   
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tv1
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It seems that every person has their own favourite method and product for finishing - and that one person's experience is often not a good indicator of how someone else will find it!

At least, that's my experience.

I guess a lot of that is down to the amount of practice (aka trial and error) that you've had with a technique.  If you've got skills from a body shop, then you're going to be able to get a great finish from a good spray set-up.  Whereas if I used a spray kit, I'm pretty confident that it would turn out pretty badly!

I've known people use Ronseal gloss varnish, and get a great looking - gloss - finish with it.  But I also know that they've practised for a long time, and on many guitars, to get it looking that good.

I've only ever used basic stains and oils on mine - I can generally get an OK finish with that, although I've never tried to get a high gloss result.

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Mezy
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that was why i suggested taking it to a small body shop, one i worked at would paint anything, from rc model air planes to hand made gun buts, 

I like 2k even if you are not adept with a spray gun you can still get a reasonable finish and if you put enough build on it, even with a paint roller, you can flat back and polish to get a mirror finish


   
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tv1
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that was why i suggested taking it to a small body shop

How prepped would they (probably) want the body @mezy?

Grain filled and sanded to 600?  Would that be good enough for primer coat?

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What are you finishing acoustic or electric guitar

Some people call me a tool, others are less complimentary. Tools being useful things.


   
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Boo
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I find the best way with painting wood, as that is the substrate we are using for guitar building, is to wipe everything down with a damp cloth, this raises the grain. Sand it all flat again and then grain fill, maybe two or three times after sanding back each time. Cake it all in 2k primer, most of which will get sanded off when flattening it back, going through the grades, up to 800 grade for metallics/pearls or to 600 grade for solid 2k colours. Spray your Basecoat colours and then seal it all in with 2 to 3 coats of 2k clear. All of this can be purchased from car body shop suppliers up and down the country in the UK. It is all available in rattle cans if you don’t have the specialist equipment, it’s all the same stuff as what is used in pro spray guns. I use auto 2k because it is what I know, I’ve used it for painting everything and anything, just be very conscientious when spraying it, it is carcinogenic, use a very good mask with filters, gloves and a spray suit (all fairly inexpensive). The great thing about 2k lacquer is that if you mess it up by getting runs and sags, is that you can sand it back flat carefully, going through the grades and polish it up to a mirror finish. There are probably much better ways and products to be used for guitar finishing, I just don’t know about them yet. We need @markbailey to do a course on a range of finishes, including spray finishing and products used. For now I will continue with auto 2k and you should try it, just have a go. If you need help and advice before, during and after, just write something in this forum and I (we) will help you out. 

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I will add that this is only for electric guitars, not acoustic. 

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Jonathan Hodgson
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@rocknroller912

"What are you finishing acoustic or electric guitar?"

Hopefully both, but I'm primarily asking with regards to electric at the moment, because I'm envisaging the first acoustic I build will never leave the house and so I can probably go with something less hard wearing and easier to apply. Plus I'm thinking more of a natural wood feel for that rather than a gloss finish.


   
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Rocknroller912
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@jonhodgson

In my experience it's not what type of finish you apply that makes the difference between good and bad results, it's the wood preparation and attention to detail like flatting between coats and the final rubbing/polishing. Most finishes look bad until polished.

I've finished a solid body bubinga wood guitar with only Danish Oil which fills the grain and also dries quite hard so that  any kind of top coat can be applied but it's not essential for the home player to have a top coat in my opinion. I've seen guitars with only a wax finish which look very nice.

Obviously a professional builder would want something harder wearing. One big advantage of Danish Oil is that it's easy to touch up scratches, just rub down and re apply. There is a lot of flatting needed so that you almost take it back to the bare wood leaving only the filled grain. Then apply final coats. A good instrument polish brings out a shine without being cheap and tacky looking.

if you are looking for a really high gloss shine to see a reflection in, then it's getting into the professional area and I think Mark is doing a video on this which I'm looking forward to.

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Jonathan Hodgson
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@rocknroller912
My first acoustic probably won't leave the house, but my electrics will need to survive the real world of gigging in pubs (so might a future acoustic, but I'll deal with that when I get to it).
There's no shortage of information out there on how to apply different sorts of finishes (Brad Angove and Highline guitars have videos covering various sorts, and Derek from Big D guitars is the man when it comes to hand-applied wood stains, and there are others).
But the issue I have is that since most of them are based in North America, they tend to be using products which are not available in the UK, at least with the same brand name. So while their instructional videos are useful, their recommendations for specific products don't help much. And there seems to be a dearth of options from specialist luthier suppliers in the UK, who you would hope would have at least vetted the products they stock to be suitable.
So hence me asking what people have actually used here. It's not really the process I'm asking about, I've watched a hundred videos on that probably, rather people's experiences with products I can actually buy here. "I used XXX, It was great but you have to make sure that you YYY" or "I tried ZZZ, it sucks".

So far 2K is looking like the lead contender.


   
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Bill Flude
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Loads of videos out there - most seem to be from the USA - lots of the people spraying finishes probably won’t live long as they seem to have the same approach to wearing protective equipment and extraction as they do having guards on cutting equipment......

Some seem to get a good finish from wipe on products to get deep gloss until they show the guitar from an angle and you can see that it is far from flat. 

My home builds have used Liberon Finishing Oil (as recommended in the online course) - after 5 or 6 coats and a gentle application of micro-crystalline wax I have a pleasing sheen.

 

Waiting for Mark’s take on home spraying - I have a compressor already ......

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mark bailey
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Bump! This is a great Q...

I too would love to know 

What clear coat finishes are people in the UK using?

We use our CureUV system but realise it is prohibitively expensive...

Measure twice, cut once...


   
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tv1
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Bump! This is a great Q...

I too would love to know 

What clear coat finishes are people in the UK using?

We use our CureUV system but realise it is prohibitively expensive...

I've only ever used oil-type finishes - though I've experimented with a few different ones including the standard Liberon finishing oi, Tru-oil, Crimson's finishing oils, and various Osmo products.

Also tried wax over the top of oil, though that didn't work out so well!

I've applied oil-over-stain and oil straight onto wood.

 

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Edwin
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I use Spray Max 2k and 1k rattle cans. Sprays well and easy to level-sand and polish. It's the stuff Brad Angove uses most of the time in his rattle can video's. These are available in the UK.

WARNING: nasty stuff, especially the 2k clear. Wear a good quality mask and gloves at all times....

Measure once, cut straight away and maybe you're lucky......


   
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Jonathan Hodgson
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Posted by: @markbailey 
We use our CureUV system but realise it is prohibitively expensive...

The Solarez products look like a great solution for the home luthier Since they don't need specialist UV equipment (sunlight will do) or spray equipment (though they have versions that work with spray guns if you want that), there are different options depending on your priorities with regards to hardness, odour and workability, and they are reasonably priced, unfortunately you can't buy them here and shipping from the states is a bit nuts as I indicated in my first post.
I did suggest to Crimson Guitars in an email last year that they should look at "I can't believe it's not lacquer" in the hope that they might choose to become an importer, but that's not happened yet so I'm guessing it won't.


   
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tv1
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I did suggest to Crimson Guitars in an email last year that they should look at "I can't believe it's not lacquer" in the hope that they might choose to become an importer, but that's not happened yet so I'm guessing it won't.

Looks like their UK distributor is only focused on the surfboard products.

Wonder if it's something @markbailey would be interested in investigating - if it's genuinely a useful product for guitar finishing that'd be suitable for us to use ...

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Deej
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We use our CureUV system but realise it is prohibitively expensive...

But it’s damn lovely especially the Matt  ? 

I have too many guitars...said no one in the world..ever!


   
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